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Eating Raw Vegetables

Topic Made On: Mar 13, 2011 07:16pm
Bazz

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I am about to start a course of FCR. I don't eat meat but eat fish. I have been told not to eat salad.I believe raw vegetables are good for one's health by bringing the red cell count up. What is classed as "salad" and can I remove contamination before eating vegetables. I want to juice veg. Carrots, apples etc can be peeled, but what do I do about spinach and broccoli etc? Other patients must have encountered these problems and overcome them, so would be pleased to receive feedback.




Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 09:57am
Swainson

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You might like to reqad this article www.oncology-hematology.jwatch.org/cgi/content/full/2009/113/1



Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 11:48am
Robert Cork

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In all of my treatments with Fludabine I have been told to be careful of uncooked vegetables and non-peel able fruits.

In my own experience, I was extra careful of these foods when I was on chemo and my neutrophil count was ‘tanking’.

I don’t think there is a right and wrong answer, just exercise caution, especially when your counts are low.

Regards

Robert



Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 04:14pm
pastongriffin

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The problem with salads, fruit and also eggs and soft cheeses is that they can cause infections in immunocompromised people - as I know to my cost! If your neutrophils are down you are advised to have a neutroponic diet and there are books to help you from Macmillan etc... If you really want to risk it, just wash very very thoroughly. I have found such a problem with infections post chemo that I wouldn't risk it! You might be lucky but there again.....



Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 05:00pm
tewksboy53

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I have just completed my first treatment of FCR and nobody mentioned
anything regarding fruit or veg to me. I have eaten salad, leaves, toms,
cucumber etc, and soft cheese. I have had 2 lots of FC and did exactly the same through those treatments so i am slighty confused on what has been advised. I go again on the 22nd March for round 2 so will be asking
what i am supposed to avoid.
Regards
Mark.



Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 06:06pm
Zeno

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Mark
This is really quite interesting. I also do not eat meat from four or two legged animals and have not done so for 28 plus years, but eat fish (being a fisherman I would!). I have had FCR, R + Steroids and in January/February this year, ESHAP-R over two weeks. No suggestion has been made that I should not eat raw vegetables and I continued to eat my normal diet. There must be a reason this has been suggested. However, My Consultant, a university reader and researcher as opposed to an NHS employed, gave no indication as to what I can and cannot eat. It is possible, though, that FCR can cause nausea and perhaps raw vegetables can exacerbate this condition. Just a thought although I personally had no issues with eating! I hope this helps. Oh, and my neuts dropped at one stage to .35!

Zeno



Replied On: Mar 14, 2011 06:23pm
smreynard

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My husband has finished his course of FCR and was not told not to eat salad. I think what they meant was not to eat prepared salads from a buffet. As long as you buy the salad and wash it yourself there should be no problem. We have been told not to go on an all-inclusive holiday for this very reason concerning pre-prepared foods.



Replied On: May 17, 2011 01:20pm
Nick

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As an avid gardener, as well as taking on board precautions with gardening itself, I wonder if I should tailor my crops towards foods that will be blanched or cooked befor eating? I love the refreshing tastes of salads and the crispness of texture, especially in the summer. Does supermarket packaged veg carry more microbes than home grown?

Nick



Replied On: May 18, 2011 06:17pm
Bazz

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Supermarket packaged veg is full of bacteria as it breeds in the damp atmosphere within the packaging. Healthy people can have upset stomachs through eating bagged salads. We use a solution of Milton, directions on bottle, to sterilize unblanched veg and fruit. If you rinse off after with fresh water you can't taste the product. We also cook our soft fruit, eg.strawberries, very lightly with butter and brown sugar, caramalises the fruit and still tastes super. This may sound OTT but who knows where to draw the line, regards Bazz



Replied On: May 19, 2011 08:52am
Nick

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Thanks Bazz for the tips, I don't think I'll need any packaged veg for a while, but will take note of the risks. I love jam making and have always had to fight my kids and the slugs for my share of the crop, they will probably win. Will try to stick to peeled fresh fruits. TRY



Replied On: May 19, 2011 03:41pm
Zeno

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Nick

Your comment is not strictly true. Packaged prepared vegetables and salads are pack gassed to destroy bacteria. Raw vegetables can contain Escheria Coli strains and Salmonella. Professionally, I would advise against using Milton on vegetables. The best method always is fresh water. Correct cooking, preferably steaming, will destroy most pathogens on vegetables.

Milton is a sodium hypochlorite and is similar to bleach albeit in a milder form. Continuous use could cause internal damage if the solutions are not carefully monitored. In addition, Milton taints the vegetables.

Regards



Replied On: May 19, 2011 10:58pm
pendle witch

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Nick, I am sure salads you grow yourself must be healthy, provided you don't use any pesticides on them. Deeper coloured salad leaves are a good source of beta carotene, the anti oxidant. I suppose it all depends on what baggage the lettuce comes with - grow it yourself and you know what has affected it and it isn't packaged. If you buy either cut or bagged up salad, you don't really know if it has been sprayed or treated. Eat the right sort of salad and you MUST be eating far better than if you go for, say a ready meal, take away or whatever. Plant based foods are just so much better for you than dairy or meat based. It's a no brainer.



Replied On: May 20, 2011 08:15pm
Nick

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Zeno,That makes sense I wondered why they last so long in the bag, or is that down to genetics and additives? Good to meet a fellow angler. Dark salad leaves are as healthy as they can be, no pesticides and sterile organic feeds, as they are well spaced and as free from damp as possible.(never that dry in Wales!) I assume a good wash is enough? I guess my biggest concern is natural solid fertiliser, I never use manure and don't wear gloves when using composts, I keep it moist to avoid spores, When should I start being more cautious and consider a mask? Or is that over the top?

Understanding the statistics for the immunosuppressant effect of our disease, tells me that precautions are not just reserved for those in later CLL, pre, during and post treatment. But is there a guideline we are advised to follow or just wait untill we start getting infections?

Nick



Replied On: May 21, 2011 08:40am
Zeno

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Nick, so you are also a fisherman! I am off to Norway shortly for some healthy salmon fishing and exercise in preparation for the next round of chemo. Regrettably the ESHAP-R administered January and February has proved not so good despite the very positive reduction in the lymphs. However, onwards and upwards with that!

The issue for us who have CLL is that the immune system is pretty well shot especially if you have had chemo of one sort or another. Therefore we become more vulnerable to infections. However, care and attention is the key. So when using fertilisers or manures, caution should be exercised. Raw animal manures are usually best dug into the soil before planting. I compost down all of my garden and vegetable waste which is then put back into the soil. As to whether you were gloves or not is a decision to be made but I normally wear them for protection.

Thorough washing of salads and vegetables with water is the best method especially if you leave the skins on potatoes or carrots as I do. With our water shortage, i save the water used for washing veg etc and use it for watering my garden especially with this exceptionally dry weather we are having here in the south east.



Replied On: May 21, 2011 08:43am
Zeno

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My comment re Milton should have been directed at Bazz!! Must read more carefully!



Replied On: May 22, 2011 11:54am
Bazz

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Hi Zeno
I am now receiving R-FC, and was told by my specialist to avoid uncooked veg, and peel whatever I could unless cooked. This is more of a problem for me as I am a vegetarian. I know that the catering trade use sterilising tablets for salads. This led me to decided that if I want to eat or juice raw unpeelable veg than I needed to sterilise. The hospital and the MacMillian Cancer Trust advise that washing alone is not enough. Milton mentions its use for salads and veg, and the taste can be removed after with tap water. For years, mothers have sterilised babies bottles at least three times a day, with Milton to prevent mouth and stomach infections. I may only use Milton once a week to eat lettuce. Personally it may seem "over the top" but I would prefer to be safe than sorry. Where does one "draw the line"?
Regards
Bazz



Replied On: May 23, 2011 09:15am
Zeno

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Bazz, it is always difficult to decide what is best in our circumstances. When I had RFC, I cannot recall any specific advice about what to eat. Like you, I eat no meat, only fish. Being a fisherman I would! The catering trade don’t use chemicals for cleaning vegetables or salads for H&S reasons. As Milton is a mild form of bleach this substance can be classified as carcinogenic. However, the best advice is always to follow what your consultant is telling you as chemotherapies do affect individuals in many ways. A case in point is that I and another person started the same ESHAP-R regimen at the same time and period. The other person lost all his hair within a week of the first treatment. I lost about one third of mine! Best wishes with the treatment.



Replied On: May 23, 2011 10:05pm
Venceremos

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I love eating raw onion: should i?



Replied On: May 24, 2011 09:42am
Nick

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Know your onions, might be the best application I can think of!!



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